capollyon: Crucible is not an Outer-God. It lacks all characteristics of Outer-god, foremost it lacks agenda, ideology, desires and goals. Which are all characteristics of all outer-gods we know. Crusible is technically an evolution. A primordial force of all life, everchanging and eternal. I do not think that Hornsent worshipped Crucible as god, it looks more that they tried to create a god of their own.
NorthstriderGaming: I believe the term Outer God doesn't apply here anymore when these forces are native to these lands. They are original powers, so calling them either forces or straightup gods may be the better approach. The outer gods need a champion to channel their powers, which is probably why they are called Outer Gods - they are unable to directly interfere with the world and require a vessel.

The Greater Will needed Marika, the Formless Mother needed Mohg, the Frenzied Flame needs a vessel, The God of Rot needed Malenia. They all needed a champion while the Cruicible does not. Anyone can channel its powers, just as anyone can join the deathrite birds if they pass the ritual. So I think they are not outer gods - they are native gods.
Xenos369: The influence seen by the Crucible may be far older than the Hornsent. Its possible that Bayle and the Drakes were touched by the crucible. During Bayle's fight he seems to generate magical wings (similar to crucible knights summoning wings), and he has several horns all over his head and body. Additionally his heart is covered in horns as well. The drakes also have different aspects of the crucible, Feathers, scales, horns, and their adaptability to their environment. The farum azula elden ring (which may have existed before the erdtree) has a prominent caduceus.
falgalhutkinsmarzcal3962: My crazy theory is that the Crucible is magical keratin, which is a helix protein that composites horns, feathers, hair, hooves, fingernails, scales, claws, talons, and keeps skin healthy. There are different sects for every manifestation of keratin in-game. The Hornsent are obviously for horns, as are the rams, all horned things, and the Ancestral Followers. The various Serpents are made of scales. The feathers are for the Twinbird and the Stormhawks. The claws are for Lions and Beastmen. The Godskins clearly obsess over the skin aspect of keratin, skinning gods. As for hair, the braids are important to many factions. Metyr and the Fingers clearly are oriented toward fingernails (and even have fingernail sorceries now). Funnily, keratin keeps skin and hair healthy and young. As you age your keratin production decreases. Here is the kicker: as we age, and experience decreased keratin production, our body retains less moisture. Think of gold-tinged and hornsent excrement and its flavor text: "it does not dry out or lose its customary warmth or scent". As we age the bacterial breakdown of keratin alters our body odor, making it smell worse. Yet, the gold excrement and horn excrement remains moist and retains the same smell forever.

The reason I think keratin is important is because the "antlers" of the Ancestral Spirits are NOT true antlers (ie, made of calcium). They are described as "antler-like horns", which seems a very strange distinction to make unless keratin is important.

Another thing to consider is a different Crucible: the Crucible of Chitin. Chitin composites the exoskeletons of insects (like beetles, butterflies, ants), arachnids (spiders and SCORPIONS), crustaceans, and the cell walls of fungi (MUSHROOMS). Where is Chitin mentioned in-game? In relation to the Kindred of Rot. What spawns from the Scarlet Rot? Kindred and fungi. The Spirit Ash of Kindred states they are "chitinous".

Curiously, snail shells are made of calcium carbonate, but we have no indicator if the snake-snails have calcium shells or not. We see skeletal snails, bit cannot really know if the shells are the same as the bones.
Kmaaq: My favorite explanation of the crucible is from Scum Mage Infa, which is that the crucible is a catalyst that transforms death to power, and that there are many types of crucibles
eprimchad2576: I think people have conpletely lost the plot of what an outer god is, we learn in the dlc the "god of rot" isnt even a god but some form of revenge woven into a bud from those crusaded against by messmer, theyre not gods as much as they are spiritual acts of revenge, perhaps these outcries from the downtrodden literally create a god much like the cries of the merchants summoned the frenzied flame, but it seems apparent that the god of rot wasnt even an idea until romina made it so.
Writh811: I view the Crucible not as an Outer God but more so a terrestrial equivalent to the Elden Ring. I say Terrestrial because the power of the Crucible comes from the life that originates on the world while the power of the Elden Ring was literally sent down from Space. As weird as it sounds the best way I can put it is to quote the Great Sellen: "Glintstone is the amber of the cosmos, golden amber contains the remnants of ancient life and houses its vitality" But replace "Glintstone" with "Elden Ring" and its "amber" with "power" then replace "Golden Amber" with "The Crucible" and "remnants" with "power"
(The Elden Ring is the power of the cosmos, The Crucible contains the power of ancient life and houses its vitality)
Sellen was on to something she may not have realized. Graven rituals and jar saints start to look similar when you break it down.
kuromori8877: Everything u said is solid yeah the themes in the world should always be put into consideration
But the crucible never seemed like an outer god if the crucible is life then its what the outer gods are trying to take over to enforce their views on life,death and how they should work
beansnrice321: Personally I've noticed many connections to ancient Egyptian mythology and one of the greatest is the sun god Aten. Aten is usually depicted as a solar disk surrounded with run rays and each ray terminates with a hand. Sometimes the hands are holding ankhs, which are the Egyptian symbol of life.

So I suspect that the main god is an Aten-like greater will and that Metyr is a cut of hand from one of Aten's rays. Egypt has also had more than a few Gods of death, Anubis was replaced with Osiris, for example. So maybe Godwyn was chosen as a replacement for the old god of death?

I also suspect that canoptic jars, which were used for storing the organs of mummies, are similar to the jars filled with innards.
zeorhymer6: Basically, Marika is a god created by mortal hands. In doing so, all of her offspring are defective because of the source of her creation.
froggie610: I don't actually agree with the Crucible being an outer god, I'd like to think that the Crucible is like a big bang, being a conception of absolute vitality in life that the hornsent worship as a spiral. Additionally, there are many different interpretations of the Crucible, like how the knights of it see it as a spiral tree or great tree.

The lore item that says that the Crucible is like a current may refer to the flow of energy that vitalizes all life. Almost to a cancerous degree, as seen in the omen and hornsent horns. Perhaps ghost flame was used to put a end to people who have lived too long? At least long enough to have their blood impure?

Aug 03 2024

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